# What is your favorite flat roofing system?



## JWilliams

What is your favorite flat roofing system? and why?


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## Ed the Roofer

All systems are only as good as the installation and the weather conditions dealt with during the install.

If I had my druthers, I would prefer a built up roof, but there are not enough general roofers with talent to know how to do that adequately.

I find the white thermoplastics enjoyable to work with, especially for a detail minded person like myself, who can concentrate and allow the hours to just wither away.

Ed


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## Grumpy

Been doing modified for years. It's ok. Getting more into TPO and liking it lots.


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## apehangeralfy

TPO, I don't even like to look at the hot kettle anymore. I just look the other way as I walk on by...


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## RooferJim

single ply roofs. particularly EPDM and PVC. Although I do have a nostalgic fondness for coal tar pitch.


RooferJim
www.jbennetteroofing.com


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## Tiny

PVC,EPDM,some coatings and standing seam as well.


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## English Roofer

I love the look of Lead dressed over mop rolls other than that i recently used EPDM and would not go back to torch on at all if i can help it.
Cheers
Dave


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## RooferJim

Torching is dead ! At least it is in this part of the country and may spread to the rest of it. I have some torch equipment right next to the kettle that we dont use. may start a roofing museum for that junk LOL


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## SinglePlyGuy

Nothing beats a good PVC.

The heat-welded seam is king.

TPO is OK but I still need to see more of a track record.

I have done many TPO projects and have even done a few projects more than once (within a few years) as Warranty Claims due to material failures. 

My kettles have trees growing out of them and my torches only see time with the maintenance crews on older roofs we service...that is until I can replace them with PVC :thumbup:


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## Ed the Roofer

Which brand)s) do you prefer to install?

Sarnafil

Fiber-Tite

IBRoofing

Trocal

Duro-Last

Bond Cote

Some are hybrids, but still fall into the same family.

Ed


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## AaronB.

VFI Aromatic Aluminumized Polyurea, hands down better than all of the aforementioned systems.


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## SinglePlyGuy

Sarnafil and Fibertite are the top 2 that I go to bat with.

IB does not seem to have any presence in our area tho what I have seen at the trade shows I did like.

Trocal became HPG who then was bought out by JM if i recall correctly.

I do not currently install JM but the old HPG system was great.

Tried DuroLast on a few projects but didnt buy into the pre-fab roof thing.


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## SinglePlyGuy

*VFI Aromatic Aluminumized Polyurea, hands down better than all of the aforementioned systems.* 

Spray Foam?


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## Grumpy

AaronB. said:


> VFI Aromatic Aluminumized Polyurea, hands down better than all of the aforementioned systems.


 ...and why is that?


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## Ed the Roofer

Grumpy said:


> ...and why is that?


Because he sells and installs them and is comfortable with the results, plus the high profit margins, I would speculate.

Ed


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## AaronB.

Beacause it is a 100% seamless roofing membrane system with more elasticity than all of the aforementioned systems, except maybe EPDM. 

Because I install the entire roof myself. Because it is both flexible and tough. Easily repaired if some type of mechanical damage does occur. Because it withstands ponding water indefinitely. Because it has excellent resistance to petro chemicals and animal fats. 

Becasue it holds up as well or better than the other previously mentioned systems. 

It is not a foam, but a two part instant set membrane system.

The only thing we cannot go over is tar and gravel. For this you need to install a layer of foam first.


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## Tiny

LUUUUV ib but hate the cost!!
sarnafil
GAF EVERGUARD
bondcoat-2jobs
flexmembraine-3 jobs
custom seal basical a higher in duro-last using a 60 gen flex product.
fibertite 
gen flex
and versiweld
did 5 jm tpos like it ok.
and yes even duro-last!!
epdm,gen-flex,versico,manville,ect i install a lot of products or have in the past some i like some i dont .
Been roofing along time have installed alot of bur-coal tar 18 yrs worth then went to the condom roofing as the ole boys call it.Was with the union for along time started roofing as a helper in 79 so you know its all only as good as the installer. And there knowledge and of course product line has to be of good quality and you will come to know that over time we all seen roofing material come and go.:laughing: Sorry ed did not mean to hijack your thread.


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## Ed the Roofer

Tiny, it looks like we have nearly identical experiences, except I started in 1978 instead.

How did Custom Seal and the Mayle family end up with their patent lawsuit that Duro-Last brought against them?

Don't forget another D-L knock off, called At-Last out of LaPorte, Indiana too.

I remember meeting Steve and his Dad at a few of the Awards banquets and then Steve came to my office, but at the beginning, their shipping was a killer on price.

Ed


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## Grumpy

Ed the Roofer said:


> Because he sells and installs them and is comfortable with the results, plus the high profit margins, I would speculate.
> 
> Ed


To say that doesn't mean it is better. He just means he likes it more.


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## Grumpy

AaronB. said:


> Beacause it is a 100% seamless roofing membrane system with more elasticity than all of the aforementioned systems, except maybe EPDM.
> 
> Because I install the entire roof myself. Because it is both flexible and tough. Easily repaired if some type of mechanical damage does occur. Because it withstands ponding water indefinitely. Because it has excellent resistance to petro chemicals and animal fats.
> 
> Becasue it holds up as well or better than the other previously mentioned systems.
> 
> It is not a foam, but a two part instant set membrane system.
> 
> The only thing we cannot go over is tar and gravel. For this you need to install a layer of foam first.


 I'm not calling it bad. But for me I have lost alot of faith in so called field installed membranes. In addition nobody has ever given me a difinitive answer to how to control the thickness of any sprayed in place systems other than "the intstaller has to have an eye for it." So you are eyeballing your work? Seems like some spots will be thicker than others. 

I installed an elastomeric to manufacturer spec once. We sized an area and poured the 5 gallon bucket to the area, then spread it to the area blah blah blah. When all was said and done I thought we applied it liberally, extra thick for a good roof. The manufacturer said it was too thin during their warranty inspection. They used an elastomeric mill tester they claim. How exactly does that work other than to puncture the roof membrane to check the thickness? 

Then on this same system of pouring aprox 3 gallon per square over cement board to make a so called "seamless monolithic roof membrane", the butyl tape on the seams in the cement board ended up peeling back and puncturing or tearing the elastomeric membrane. We had all sorts of leaks. The manufacturer actually had the balls to ask me to pay them to fix a roof they warranted! It was a manufacturer product failure anyways since the seam tape failed, not an installation problem, but the fact remains that it was not the roof I was promised it would be... so we stopped selling it. 

Pretty much I think everyone in my company is at the concensus that if it's not a factory fabricated membrane it can't be trusted. We will still do coatings, but not guaranteeing them the same way we used to.

Oh and add to the mix all the spray foam roofs I've fixed, but those were pretty much due to installation error. But you can see why I have a bad taste in my mouth for these kinds of systems. 

Oh and finally, what about over spray? Just like controlling the thickness the answers I get are as follows.... "it happens." For me that's not an answer, that's an excuse.


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## AaronB.

Thickness is controlled in three ways, and we utilize all three. 

Firstly, yes, the sprayer needs to have a grasp on how much the machine sprays out per minute, per pass at the sprayers normal motive rate, what the job spec calls for, what needs to be built thicker, etc. This is done much like a BUR mopper would know if his hot is going down at the proper flow rates. You have to be at the proper application temperature, and the mopper needs to know what he's doing.

Secondly, we know how much material has been ordered, is on the job, how large an area we cover with said amount of material, mark out this area, and app.ly the product. If we have left overs, then we go back and hit thinner areas and seams, flasahings, penetrations again until this area's material is accounted for.

Lastly, we use an elcometer mil thickness guage. This is an expensive tool. It measures how thick your coating is electronically. 

Measuring a coatings, minimum thickness is the l.east of our worries in applying this awesome system.

Overspray.... Dont let it get on anything you dont want it on. Its that simple.

No seam tapes.... not needed. Instant set self-reinforcing. We can spray right up until it rains baby!

Unlike any of the elastomeric acrylics, the thicker you apply polyurea, the STRONGER it gets. So to build up at the flashings requires no reinforcement of any kind but additional spray.

Grumpy, have I ever gotten any samples in to your hands? If you were to sell this stuff, we travel. 

If youre not an owner that can be on the job, I wouldnt recommend this system.


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## AaronB.

Extra thick with acrylics is not better. There is a point at which you are screwing the pooch by adding more material.

Three gallons of properly cured acrylic will pield about 27 dry mil per 100 sq ft. 3 gallons of polyurea will yield 48 dry mil per 100 sq ft. We will go up to 100 mil. Anything beyond this is overkill, in my professional opinion.


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## SinglePlyGuy

Aaron is this considered a coating or is it a roof system?

What type of Warranties are available and who backs them?

It sounds similar to the below grade or plaza deck -type systems that I have read about. 

Is it Energy Star rated? How do you find it holds up to UV?

I typically stay away from field fabricated products for many of the reasons Grumpy pointed out. As roofers on the East Coast we seem to have enough working against us, having the membrane produced in a controlled environment rather than on the roof takes some of the chance for error out of the mix.

I am always up for learning about other products so if you have a link or something I'd like to check it out.


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## Ed the Roofer

AaronB. said:


> Grumpy, have I ever gotten any samples in to your hands? If you were to sell this stuff, we travel.


Show me how and who to market to and I would be willing.

I don't have any samples. :whistling:

Ed


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## English Roofer

I don't have any samples either but its a long way to come lol


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## AaronB.

Ed, shoot me an email or call me at my office number. I will be happy nto get you some samples. We can go over the oparticulars also. 

Maybe you, Grumpy and I can all get together and have some Dunkin Donuts coffeetalk. Remember the skit from SNL? 

This tends to be a profitable arrangement for all of us.


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## AaronB.

SinglePlyGuy said:


> Aaron is this considered a coating or is it a roof system?
> 
> What type of Warranties are available and who backs them?
> 
> It sounds similar to the below grade or plaza deck -type systems that I have read about.
> 
> Is it Energy Star rated? How do you find it holds up to UV?
> 
> I typically stay away from field fabricated products for many of the reasons Grumpy pointed out. As roofers on the East Coast we seem to have enough working against us, having the membrane produced in a controlled environment rather than on the roof takes some of the chance for error out of the mix.
> 
> I am always up for learning about other products so if you have a link or something I'd like to check it out.


It holds up to UV quite well if you use the aliphatic polyureas or aluminumized, copper, grey or black aromatic polyureas. Aromatics are better for long term durability, but if you want a UV stable color, aliphatics are needed.

There are some various specs on gaining Energy Star ratings. You can waterproof seams, fasteners, flashings, drains, etc with an aromatic polyurea, and go with a white acrylic @ 2 gallons per square for the required 70% aged reflectivity of the Energy Star rating. OR you could go with an aliphatic color stable white to achieve same.

The acrylic will wear like any other acrylic, but can be recoated after about 10 years with a pressure wash, primer, and acrylic.

VersaFlex guarantees their aromatic (40 mil) with an acrylic latex paint topcoat colorant if applied directly behind the polyurea application BEFORE the reaction is complete. This is must be done within 4 hours. It has to be done this way with this spec because the paint will actually cross-link with the polyurea since it is applied before the molecular cross-linking is completed.

Due to cost considerations, we generally apply an aluminumized aromatic polyurea/urethane hybrid at 48 mil ADFT that weathers to a light grey and provides a little over 50% aged reflectivity. We offer ten years on this system, and polyurea mfg warranties are also available.

Field processing is the only way that this system is able to be applied since it is instant setting (10-30 seconds for hybrids and 4-6 seconds for pure polyureas). You KNOW if youre off-ratio, and you have to stop immediately, clean up the faulty material, solve the proportioning issue, and continue spraying. If you mess this system up, its your fault 99% of the time, and therefore need a wealth of technical info, the right equipment, and spraying experience to get it right.

This is what we do.


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## Grumpy

AaronB. said:


> Thickness is controlled in three ways, and we utilize all three.
> 
> Firstly, yes, the sprayer needs to have a grasp on how much the machine sprays out per minute, per pass at the sprayers normal motive rate, what the job spec calls for, what needs to be built thicker, etc. This is done much like a BUR mopper would know if his hot is going down at the proper flow rates. You have to be at the proper application temperature, and the mopper needs to know what he's doing.
> 
> Secondly, we know how much material has been ordered, is on the job, how large an area we cover with said amount of material, mark out this area, and app.ly the product. If we have left overs, then we go back and hit thinner areas and seams, flasahings, penetrations again until this area's material is accounted for.
> 
> Lastly, we use an elcometer mil thickness guage. This is an expensive tool. It measures how thick your coating is electronically.
> 
> Measuring a coatings, minimum thickness is the l.east of our worries in applying this awesome system.
> 
> Overspray.... Dont let it get on anything you dont want it on. Its that simple.
> 
> No seam tapes.... not needed. Instant set self-reinforcing. We can spray right up until it rains baby!
> 
> Unlike any of the elastomeric acrylics, the thicker you apply polyurea, the STRONGER it gets. So to build up at the flashings requires no reinforcement of any kind but additional spray.
> 
> Grumpy, have I ever gotten any samples in to your hands? If you were to sell this stuff, we travel.
> 
> If youre not an owner that can be on the job, I wouldnt recommend this system.


 Aaron you gave me a sample and a ball park price. Simply put, I can't afford you  

Plus seiously I can't sell one product that I have only one installer for. I become too dependant upon that installer and if for some reason we ever break partnership I am left stuck holding the bag. You also bring up another point, I don't want any system where I'd have to be locked on the job. In theory I want multiple crews out working every day, that'd be impossible for me to be in 4 places at once, plus doing my sales and business management too. Impossible.


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## AaronB.

.....And that's where we come in.

You dont have to be on the job to know youre getting a quality job.

I am an owner operator so that you dont need to be one in order to get your customers a polyurea roofing system.

With what you already know and sell, you could easily sell this system at higher prices than mine. I am offering you a good value.

If our system does fail before your retirement, I can show you how to properly repair and maintain our system. You have intelligent roofing people. They can be trained for this aspect without expensive outlays.

It really is a win-win-win situation, Grumpy.


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## Grumpy

AaronB. said:


> Ed, shoot me an email or call me at my office number. I will be happy nto get you some samples. We can go over the oparticulars also.
> 
> Maybe you, Grumpy and I can all get together and have some Dunkin Donuts coffeetalk. Remember the skit from SNL?
> 
> This tends to be a profitable arrangement for all of us.


 I prefer Javaman from Mad TV. LOL When he was popular I was working in a machine shop and took my saftey glasses and painted big yellow blood shot eyes on them.  


Anyways we should have met at the CRCA show last week. Are either of you going to the AirVent seminar?


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## Ed the Roofer

Grumpy said:


> I prefer Javaman from Mad TV. LOL When he was popular I was working in a machine shop and took my saftey glasses and painted big yellow blood shot eyes on them.
> 
> 
> *Anyways we should have met at the CRCA show last week. Are either of you going to the AirVent seminar?*


Chit, I missed the CRCA? I didn't write it down in my calender.

What is the Air Vent schedule for the North side?

I got a nice document e-mailed to me from Paul Scelci that is now available on the Air Vent website, with some good thermal imaging photos on the inside of an attic, before and after balanced ventilation was done and corrected. Too bads it used PAV's instead of Ridge Vents.

I wonder why they didn't do a test home for those results?

Ed


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## Grumpy

The dates should all be on the airvent site. However we are going the 13th of february.

LOL I'll try to remind ya of the CRCA next year, old man


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## Ed the Roofer

Grumpy said:


> The dates should all be on the airvent site. However we are going the 13th of february.
> 
> LOL I'll try to remind ya of the CRCA next year, old man


I looked up and registered for the Air Vent Seminar for the 13nth last night.

I "May" change my mind and go to the one the day earlier, "If" I decide to go down to Florida, possibly sharing a ride with Aaron and/or Tiny. 

I don't have the funds to do it on my own right now, but I surely would like to meet Tom and Chris in person, plus any of the other guys who are coming down, especially Mike Hicks and his crew he is bringing along.

Last minute call and a flip of the coin, as long as I don't lose the coin, maybe I can afford the dollar meals at Mc-D's or Wendys. LOL

Ed


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## Grumpy

I wanted to go to the polyurea school. Infact I really wanted to go and planned on it. However with the winter coming a month early, and the other training courses, It's just not going to happen. 

I was also supposed to go to Penn. for the Versico training and certification in Feb. however I can't afford that either. Although I plan to go to Michigan in March for a Versico training. 

With this winter coming too early, and having a large job left undone, and having a GC I have been doing work for for years owing me a substantial ammount of money (probably won't be workign for him anymore) I am scraping by to pay the bills. The good news is with the winter being so harsh I have a good jump start on the new year and will hit the ground running in spring.


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## bolga

JWilliams said:


> What is your favorite flat roofing system? and why?


 


80 mil IB pvc. in red because my face gets so damn burnt with white & tan.


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## RoofPro

*Reply to original question*

If your looking for a roof that will last, won’t leak and will put up with a lot of abuse its hard to beat a 4 (or 5) ply gravel surface Built Up Roof. Asphalt is good, coal tar is even better. (RooferJim – are you really nostalgic for that stuff? Man – just thinking about it makes my eyes burn ☺.) 

SBS modified is ok – but defiantly more prone to problems – wrinkles, cap sheet granule loss, blisters. 

I like single plys a lot, but only when the roof is not subject to foot traffic and other abuse. EPDMs been around since the 60’s and since the manufacturers switched from glue to tape at the seams they have performed exceptionally well. I also like the fact that any tool you need to install EPDM can be found at the neighborhood hardware store 
I also like PVC – hard to beat a good heat welded seam. Unfortunately I’ve inspected a number of jobs where the welds are not good. Still if you need a reflective roof PVC is the way to go. 

Not a big fan of TPO, it’s a relative newcomer to the US market and the manufacturer’s are still playing with the formula, trying to balance the need to meet UL and FM requirements for fire resistance with the need for a roof that will hold up to UV light. Last year at the NRCA technical committee reported problems with TPO membrane surface cracking along the backside of seams along with other problems. I agree with SinglePlyGuy – need to see more of a good track record before I’d recommend TPO.


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## David_24

IB roofing is best. there is nothing like walking in front of the robot and kicking the roof . HAHHA


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## SinglePlyGuy

I have always been interested in IB Roofing but they apparently have no presence in our area. Even when I stop by their booth at trade shows and get contact names...never get a call back lol.

They might be the ONLY heat welded system that I have not installed....their loss!


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## OUTLAW

I was on a 22 year old .045 EPDM Firestone roof today. Glued seams and all. Looks fantastic. It belongs to an old roofer that retired a couple of years ago. These guys did top-notch work. He still swears by BUR.

Best thing about the whole story is this guy has hired me to put on a metal standing seam roof on the mansard. Its 10 sq. straight run with one hip. I priced it at 9K. He hired me on the spot without taking any other bids. I had never met the guy before, but he said he has heard about me and didn't want anybody else on his roof. My head grew ten sizes bigger immediatly. This old-timer is twice my age and I have never had such a compliment.


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## RoofPro

You've stuck gold Outlaw - Im sure I don't need to tell you, but treat that job like your doing your mom's roof.


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## Grumpy

SinglePlyGuy said:


> I have always been interested in IB Roofing but they apparently have no presence in our area. Even when I stop by their booth at trade shows and get contact names...never get a call back lol.
> 
> They might be the ONLY heat welded system that I have not installed....their loss!


I've had the exact same problem and they do have distrobution in my area. I contacted them first since I have heard such good things about them, but never got a response so went to Genflex who then ceased PVC when firestone bought them, so now onto Versico. for the record I haven't done any PVC yet but I see that as the natural progression from TPO once we can get more practice and increase our production, we're too slow.


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## buildpinnacle

Assuming the deck is rated appropriately, the best roofing system on earth is a 5-ply ballasted coal tar pitch roof. A close second would be a base + 4-ply type VI BUR w/ ballast. The problem is since the 80's when modifieds started hitting the market and the progression into single ply, there are very few 'old school' roofers that have the ability to install these systems. The BUR system takes more equipment, space, time, and causes much more distruption to the tenant, but worth it if conditions allow.

We have used primarily modified bitumens and TPO the past few years. The majority of TPO we have installed is Versico. My problems are they are very susceptible to hail impact (job security?). We also do a ton of metal roof restorations, and I too am looking for the perfect system.


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## Roofing St Petersburg

My favorite flat rooting system is single ply roofs with PVC.


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## Ed the Roofer

Roofing St Petersburg said:


> My favorite flat rooting system is single ply roofs with PVC.


What brands do you install in Florida and for how many years so far?

I would suspect FiberTite in your area.

Ed


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## AaronB.

3#foam and a polyurea barrier!!!!! You cant beat [email protected]!!!!


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## epdmcoatings

I think there is only one thing in which we like our roof and that is no leakage and strong roof that protect us from strong weather and hot sunshine and these season did not do any thing of your roof.


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## yanceyman1

Altough I agree with most of you, I still like torch down single ply. Incase you didn't know this, many of the companies that Ed has a preference to have been involved in MANY class action suits due to material failure. What do these companies do? They file chapter 11 and continue with a new name and a new "formula". I am currently bidding a Trocal roof that has failed at all the flashing details, (I'm adding pics.). When I attempted to help the owner with warranty issues I was told, "wait in line".
I have been doing torch for 20 years and have never had a material failure. A few install issues, but not material. YES, PVC and TPO are wonderfull to work with. But when you are running 35 guys with welders, who has time to, "pick" all their seams. With torch I can simply do my final walk visually and pick up install issues.
So call me old school, but after millions of dollars of torch decks with little or no problems for 20 years, I'll dance with who brought me here.


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## RooferJim

How old was this roof ? 



RooferJim
www.jbennetteroofing.com


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## yanceyman1

12 years


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## RooferJim

Thats strange, I thought they stoped making Trocal almost 20 years ago.
was it an unreinforced membrane ? interesting.


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## akismith678

My personal choice is PVC.


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## Joe Roofer

I've done a lot of modified, standing seam and exposed fastened metal, some elastomeric coating (some with a guy named Aaron?) and one house with TPO. I hate the coating, junk is how I feel about. Freaking mess. I know of too many leaks for it to be a functional system (fortunately not on any I had anything to do with _yet_. Aaron's work really stinks.) Torch I dislike. Mess on the shoes and the fear of fire is ever present. *TPO all the way!* I'm sold and have complete faith in the product. The only good thing about having so many houses here with the coating on them is _I know TPO will be on them shortly._


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## Joe Roofer

yanceyman1 said:


> Altough I agree with most of you, I still like torch down single ply. Incase you didn't know this, many of the companies that Ed has a preference to have been involved in MANY class action suits due to material failure. What do these companies do? They file chapter 11 and continue with a new name and a new "formula". I am currently bidding a Trocal roof that has failed at all the flashing details, (I'm adding pics.). When I attempted to help the owner with warranty issues I was told, "wait in line".
> I have been doing torch for 20 years and have never had a material failure. A few install issues, but not material. YES, PVC and TPO are wonderfull to work with. But when you are running 35 guys with welders, who has time to, "pick" all their seams. With torch I can simply do my final walk visually and pick up install issues.
> So call me old school, but after millions of dollars of torch decks with little or no problems for 20 years, I'll dance with who brought me here.


That's a improper use of unreinforced flashing, a roofer failure by the look of it. I hope my pipes don't do that. It looks like a simple repair none the less.


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## RooferJim

TPO is not as time tested as PVC membrane though. I know of a lot of PVC roofs holding well after twenty and even thirthy year service. EPDM Rubber roofs the same, although the laps and flashings will in many cases need to be redone with EPDM. With the taped seams now I think they will have less of a maintenence issue.


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## yanceyman1

Thanks for the imput joe. But those are pics of the manufacture designed and fabricated flashing kits. You know the kind, mostly commercial roofs, you send them a set of prints and they send out your roof. You weld it together and BAM!, you got a new roof. Until BOOM! it starts to leak! And then noone wants to take responsibility.:blink:


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## RooferJim

Are you sure it was Trocal ? They have not been around for a while.


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## yanceyman1

Yes, I could tell by the big, "Tro-Cal" stamp on the material.


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## RooferJim

Then it must be older than 12 years


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## Joe Roofer

Still, IMO if it's just a few curbs (or other small details) it only needs a repair that may take only a few hours. If it was the field then it needs a whole new roof. If you can sell it by all mean sell it. I see one ply modified as a down grade from PVC/TPO. Two ply might be in the ball park.


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## Ansel

Best Roof for Flat .... 

All things being equal I would have to say a three ply hot type IV glass (JM is best choice) with modified cap (torch on Derbigum) .... or mop-on Tamko SBS and then flood coat and gravel ..... 

But the real question is what is the best roof for the particular job ..... Most residential homes are well served by TPO - EPDM or Modifieds .... Once again, depends on the particular job ..... each has pluses and minuses .... but with respect to the TPO the jury is still out on that membrane .... see below from the MRCA dated 2/10/10..... Not good for TPO ...... 

*February 10, 2010 * 


 *T&R Committee Advisory on TPO*  
Information is being circulated in the industry indicating that high solar loading and elevated temperature lead to the premature exhaustion of anti aging components such as anti oxidants, UV absorbers and heat and light stabilizing compounds within TPO. This could lead to the breakdown of the sheet in affected areas.

This also might explain some reported problem applications with localized deterioration of membrane. One manufacture has recently changed formulation to account for this problem; another advises their product not be "subjected" to high thermal or solar loading; while others remain silent. Southern states appear to have this problematic local condition due to the heat load these roofs experience.

The committee believes that enough information has surfaced concerning TPO accelerated weathering due to solar or thermal loading to advise members to:

Review roof plans for situations where sun light is reflected back on membrane; such as areas below metal and glass or highly reflective curtain walls, or high profile reflective wall flashings.

Look for heat emitting equipment or heat exhausting vents or dark emissive materials laid on the roof that can elevate the temperature of the covered sheet; as well as areas under or over elevated temperature operations.

If situations exist that may commonly elevate temperatures over 160 degrees or increase solar loads beyond "normal" incoming solar load, question the manufacturer as to the suitability of their product for the situation; consider changing the product to a material that will clearly withstand the loading; consider changes in design to forestall the loading.

If you have existing TPO roofing subjected to these situations you may well want to inspect the applications for incipient, developing or obvious local problems. The manufacturer can then be approached for direction in addressing or rectifying any deficiency.

Please inform the committee of any problem found as well as any reaction from the manufacturer involved.

T&R Committee


----------



## peterjames

The immediate benefits of having a flat roof system are its cost efficient use of available space. With a traditional roof, the angular slope means a great deal of unusable space goes between the ceiling and the surface of the roof. This is what we typically call the attic. On a flat roof you make the maximum use of space below the roof. Also because the roof is flat, you can use the space on top of the roof as well. Recreational roof gardens and other such things are common uses for the newfound space. It also makes the installation of solar panels much easier.


----------



## Scott Holloway

SinglePlyGuy said:


> Nothing beats a good PVC.



How many years can you get out of the best available PVC?


----------



## jimsonburg

Flat roof systems are roofs that are built so that they are nearly flat. They are not completely flat; otherwise water would build up on the roof and would eventually start to get inside the building. Flat roofs are built with a slight incline. They are required to have at least a one-eighth-inch difference in height over each foot of the roof. There are five main types of flat roof systems. The best flat-roofing solutions will be Modified Bitumen.

A modified bitumen roof is a multiple-ply roof that is made with modified bituminous membranes, which are made out of a blend of asphalt and a polymer. This allows the asphalt to take on characteristics of the polymer, which is similar to materials used in single-ply roofs.


----------



## Grumpy

Scott Holloway said:


> How many years can you get out of the best available PVC?


 20 years without a doubt, when properly installed. What'll happen is the insulation and any wood members beneath the roof will rot out before the membrane. PVC and EPDM will truly last a lifetime.


----------



## PTROOFING

On residential low-slopes we use Mule Hide SBS Modified Self Adhered over new ply wood decking for small jobs. Other than that its cold process adhered modified all the way! We do small built up roofs using asphalt and coal tar at times when needed.


----------



## Grumpy

Modified adhered directly to plywood? Not my favorite. Isn't that a 10 year roof? How many plys?


----------



## daviddeschaine

*We Don't Do Many Commercial Jobs - But Roofed Residential*

*Flintlastic with Full Coverage Grace Ice & Water Shield?*

Use of CertainTeed's Flintlastic SA NailBase in a self-adhering system permits complete mechanical attachment to nailable substrates, preserving the integrity of the substrate for future tear-offs and adding additional waterproofing performance capabilities to the overall system. Flintlastic SA NailBase also adds to the fire resistance of the roof system, enabling UL Listing of the roof system.

*We use on flat shed dormers & porches, ect...*

*Outstanding Warranty Options*

CertainTeed backs its commercial roofing systems with the confidence of three warranty choices!




JWilliams said:


> What is your favorite flat roofing system? and why?


----------



## RooferJim

Flintlastic is no good in the cold weather and not very good if you have a lot of flashing details. Its only advantage is it can be installed by shinglers for small stuff. Its basicly glorified roll roofing that is only intended to last 10 years max, although PolyGlass who invented the modified SA's has a whopping 15 year warranty.
Better to go with a nice one piece single ply.

RooferJim
www.jbennetteroofing.com


----------



## daviddeschaine

*Singly Ply - Rubber is the best for slow pitch we all know THAT!*

The question is, when completing residential homes is the Single ply rubber roof installation an option for all roofing contractors?

As long as the budget is large enough we provide the fully adhered single ply 060 rubber roof application, as stated you cannot put the rubber down in the cold, so up in Maine we offer torch down, and Flintlastic as an option because you can use a torch to help activate the adhesive for the rolled roofing material. :thumbup:


Awesome.... Love The Roofing Convesations!


----------



## RooferJim

Massachusetts "Cape Cod area" is just as cold and windy as Maine and we install single ply ,EPDM rubber and PVC, IB Roof System's all year long. Of course there are tricks of the trade when working in any weather but why put a 10 year roofs with seams with is Timberline roof that should last at least 30 years ? IB Roof systems is the only one to offer the custumer a written lifetime residential warranty or a 25 year commercial warranty. They even have colored membrane. http://www.ibroof.com/IBinfo/res_types.html


RooferJim
www.jbennetteroofing.com


----------



## Grumpy

RooferJim said:


> Flintlastic is no good in the cold weather and not very good if you have a lot of flashing details. Its only advantage is it can be installed by shinglers for small stuff. Its basicly glorified roll roofing that is only intended to last 10 years max, although PolyGlass who invented the modified SA's has a whopping 15 year warranty.
> Better to go with a nice one piece single ply.
> 
> RooferJim
> www.jbennetteroofing.com


A Certainteed 3-ply flintlastic SA system is warranted for either 15 or 20 years. I forget off the top of my head because it was for sure 15 years on the 3-ply, but I heard rumor they upped it to 20 years in 2010. 

I do agree it's better for small stuff. I also agree that single ply is my preferred membrane on typical larger roofs. I also agree it's not good in cold weather requiring at least 40 degrees farenheit or more. This means it can only be install 6-8 months out of the year around here. 

It sucks on residential most single ply manufacturers don't want to get involved. I'd have set up an IB account long ago, but due to logistics we're just not a good match for their company. In other words, my other suppliers have cranes on their trucks, IB doesn't over here so for each job I'd have to rent a crane to get the materials on the roof.


----------



## RooferJim

hey Grumpy, you should give IB a chance. They deliver to my shop or to the job and I have it all craned up with the ISO board. I have to buy that seperate. Bradco or Beacan or maybee ABC would have no problem with this typicly. another option on small jobs is to put the rolls of IB up with a power ladder.


----------



## Grumpy

I'm definetly considering IB especially because of their deck grade product. The crane thing is a killer though. Maybe I'll have to buy Ed's 30 year old crane truck LOL. Yeah right.


----------



## Billy Luttrell

Haha I am going to catch hell for this, but my fave flat roof system is JohnsMansville torch down.


----------



## Ridgewalker

There are a few old school roofers on here that like BUR roofing systems. I am also one of them, 4ply capsheet is standard but we install as many plies as needed cap it off with aggragate, SBS, Cool roof caps, ect. The key to this system is a great hot crew that works as a finely oiled machine From the Firstman down to the kettle man. We are the goto Co. when when it comes to BUR systems Around here everyone else does single ply. BUR to me is still the best system.


----------



## daviddeschaine

*BUR Roofing System worked for Years!*

I remeber when I was a young man, we did the BUR roofing method, and it worked for many, many years....That was considered to be one of the best roofing flat roof applications at the time.....



Ridgewalker said:


> There are a few old school roofers on here that like BUR roofing systems. I am also one of them, 4ply capsheet is standard but we install as many plies as needed cap it off with aggragate, SBS, Cool roof caps, ect. The key to this system is a great hot crew that works as a finely oiled machine From the Firstman down to the kettle man. We are the goto Co. when when it comes to BUR systems Around here everyone else does single ply. BUR to me is still the best system.


----------



## ecenur

JWilliams said:


> What is your favorite flat roofing system? and why?


For me it's not about the roofing system. I don't have a favorite, honestly anything that lasts a long time, is a good price & works well is my favorite!


----------



## seoforu

My favorite is EPDM.

Metal roofing and repairs
Waterproofing roofing


----------



## garabar

*Flat roofing system*

*Peel and stick*

This system comes with a 10-15 year warranty, and it's less rumpled as opposed to a hot mop system.

It goes on faster and takes less labor.


----------



## yodersroofing

*yodersroofing*

I would tryone of Conklins flat roof systems, we have several systems to choose from. Look at my websitehttp://yodersroofing.ezsitebuilderonline.com ,fill out your info and I will send you more info. Looking to add to your existing business ,become an IBO and buy factory direct. Reply to website with questions. :laughing: Thanks


----------



## yodersroofing

*yoders roofing*



SinglePlyGuy said:


> Aaron is this considered a coating or is it a roof system?
> 
> What type of Warranties are available and who backs them?
> 
> It sounds similar to the below grade or plaza deck -type systems that I have read about.
> 
> Is it Energy Star rated? How do you find it holds up to UV?
> 
> I typically stay away from field fabricated products for many of the reasons Grumpy pointed out. As roofers on the East Coast we seem to have enough working against us, having the membrane produced in a controlled environment rather than on the roof takes some of the chance for error out of the mix.
> 
> I am always up for learning about other products so if you have a link or something I'd like to check it out.


 Hi ,I am new to this site,and just saw you are interested in other products. i am an IBO of the Conklin Company,which manufactures roofing systems for almost any flat roof. Check out my website www.yodersroofing.ezsitebuilderonline.com, fill out info and I will email more information. Thanks:yes::thumbup::no: p.s. if the link to my website does not work try typing it in yourself and it should work.Thanks


----------



## Slateguy

*Flat lock copper*

I guess I'm old school, but there's no better of a roof than 20 ounce copper installed with flat lock soldered seams.


----------



## Grumpy

Slateguy said:


> I guess I'm old school, but there's no better of a roof than 20 ounce copper installed with flat lock soldered seams.


 I agree, there probably isn't anyting better. But let's see it on a 300 square shopping center or 1,000 square warehouse


----------



## jjshaggy

my favorite to install is tpo,and pvc. they're clean and easy to install. gaf freedom tpo is my fave. no glue, but i'm skeptical of it's longevity. of course coal tar pitch is the best, but as said cost, and lack of good installers has hurt this proven product. ive seen pitch roofs on chicago public schools that were 80+ years old and still in descent shape. now thats getting your moneys worth.:thumbup:


----------



## 1985gt

jjshaggy said:


> my favorite to install is tpo,and pvc. they're clean and easy to install. gaf freedom tpo is my fave. no glue, but i'm skeptical of it's longevity. of course coal tar pitch is the best, but as said cost, and lack of good installers has hurt this proven product. ive seen pitch roofs on chicago public schools that were 80+ years old and still in descent shape. now thats getting your moneys worth.:thumbup:


 
You like the SA tpo's eh? Ive never installed them I bet they are pretty fast. Got to be damn expensive though. Ive used alot of GAF tpo and it seems ok, I dont care for thier glue though I think versico's is better.


----------



## jjshaggy

1985gt said:


> You like the SA tpo's eh? Ive never installed them I bet they are pretty fast. Got to be damn expensive though. Ive used alot of GAF tpo and it seems ok, I dont care for thier glue though I think versico's is better.


 from an installers standpoint i like the s/a tpo, but personally would'nt put it on my house or busniess if i had one. i'd use something with a longer/ proven track record. they do install very fast though, but one thing that kinda slowed us was we were doing 2 layer iso w/ olybond. which can take awhile to rise if not in direct sunlight. plus crickets and saddles. did 1000's of sq. of these cookie cutter jobs for a national fitness center chain. the other PITA was they run all conduit for the building under the roof systems so 1st layer iso had alot of cuts. dont know the price difference between s/a and smooth back, but probably could make up for it in labor costs. i agree verisco glue is nice a little thinner, easier to spread.


----------



## Grumpy

I haven't installed SA TPO yet, but from what I understand about the product; I wouldn't install a SA tpo unless it was on new construction. From what I hear it goes so fast that the tear off crew couldn't tear off enough in a day to really experience any labor savings on the install. Last I checked the SA was nearly triple the price of the regular TPO, however that doesn't take into account the cost for the bonding adhesives. 

My best guess is that the labor to install the SA tpo would be nearly the same as installing mechanically attached tpo. Again I haven't worked with SA yet so this is all speculation.


----------



## 1985gt

jjshaggy said:


> from an installers standpoint i like the s/a tpo, but personally would'nt put it on my house or busniess if i had one. i'd use something with a longer/ proven track record. they do install very fast though, but one thing that kinda slowed us was we were doing 2 layer iso w/ olybond. which can take awhile to rise if not in direct sunlight. plus crickets and saddles. did 1000's of sq. of these cookie cutter jobs for a national fitness center chain. the other PITA was they run all conduit for the building under the roof systems so 1st layer iso had alot of cuts. dont know the price difference between s/a and smooth back, but probably could make up for it in labor costs. i agree verisco glue is nice a little thinner, easier to spread.


 
They did what with the conduit! not metal deck then eh? We did a big warehouse that they ran the conduits on top also, except it was straight runs in the metal deck flues. This was a hot job and we made maps so if we ever reroof it we know where they are at. saws and conduits dont mix, you dont want to know what it costs when you shut down a production line down a day or so. :no: I would guess it might be close but we can spead glue down pretty fast. It would be interesting to compair the two on a cost basis. Ever installed a Rhino Bond system?


----------



## jjshaggy

1985gt said:


> They did what with the conduit! not metal deck then eh? We did a big warehouse that they ran the conduits on top also, except it was straight runs in the metal deck flues. This was a hot job and we made maps so if we ever reroof it we know where they are at. saws and conduits dont mix, you dont want to know what it costs when you shut down a production line down a day or so. :no: I would guess it might be close but we can spead glue down pretty fast. It would be interesting to compair the two on a cost basis. Ever installed a Rhino Bond system?


 you had to see this to beleive it. miles of plastic conduit everywhere. wish i had pics to show u. 1st layer iso we cut to make level 2nd layer to make look level w/ roof line. we did 2nd job on metal deck mechanically attached tpo and had to cut into new roof cuz had screws in conduit. even tho we tried to mark where conduit was, but impossibe to not make mistake. so they went to pre cast concrete decks. hence the olybond. still was a pain in the ass. yes grumpy these were new construction. i supervised some subs for these jobs and they in in their many years of expereince had never seen anything like these roofs. no never installed rhino bond system. who is the manafacturer?


----------



## Grumpy

OMG Rhino Bond http://www.olyfast.com/product.aspx?catID=25&prodID=625 

Not my style. Heating the mebrane from the top side to adhere the fastener on the bottom side... I want to see some long term real world results before I adopt a technology like that.


----------



## 1985gt

I couldnt find it on the OMG site but check this out. Ten years is some what young, but it really is a nice way to go. less screws and no glue, we can install these for about the same price as a F/A EPDM the equipment is kinda expensive.

www.flexroofingsystems.com/documents/​rhinobond/Flex%20...

• Proven attachment
method with over
10 years and
1,000,000 square
feet installed​experience


----------



## Grumpy

Similair to the old EPDM system that had the button caps. I forget the system name, all the old roofs that had it are almost all replaced now, but it was the same idea as the rhino.


----------



## 1985gt

Are you talking about the one where you would cut a 12"x12" piece of EPDM and screw that down to the deck. Then when you layed out your sheet you would use the old seam adhesive to adhere it? Ive only seen one of these roofs. To the epdm style was a good idea untill they were a few years old. I just hate the seam ahesive though. The rhino bond is pretty neat, and normally we dont stray too far from what we know. Its worked out pretty good so far and its just another system to sell. We have installed probably a dozen or so in the last year or two. Aslong as you calibrate the machine you cant seperate the plates from the TPO.


----------



## Grumpy

No you'd take a big sheet like on a ballasted system and before you installed the membrane you'd install a bunch of special screws into the insulation in a grid pattern, then after you installed the membrane you'd put a cap over the special screws that would pinch the membrane between the top and the bottom.


----------



## 1985gt

Oh yeah that system I forgot who marketed them. We use to do repairs on a mall that had alot of that style of roofs. That IMO was one of the dumbest ideas. most of there problems were with the cap locks tearing the epdm. PITA to find leaks on. If they were wet we would just start dumping bentonite on each button. Then go back and patch them later.


----------



## Grumpy

I saw one once and don't know who marketed the system but the name Genflex was on all the boots, thus I assume it was a Genflex system.


----------



## tumpline

Installed a few of those button cap systems, It was a firestone system that we used.
Pain in the ass to repair a broken button.

When a button would break for whatever reason we would have to make a cut next to the button cap, remove old button base... install new button base and new cap and then patch the hole we cut to carry out the repair.
Late 80,s was the last time I recall installing one of those systems.


----------



## RooferJim

I remember that system , It was called the Mars "mechanicly attatched roofing system" System . Made by Carlisle. The stoped it around the late eightys. There a few left in my area. they would fail around the button cap. Another interesting system was the plate bonded sytem, that was you would screw down a grid patten of "frizzbees" and glue only them to the sheet. It was very fast, made by Synenergy. Then Stafast took it over but did the plate with a PS "pressure sensitive" but that made it more expensive.

RooferJim
www.jbennetteroofing.com


----------



## RoofPro

*Mars*

RooferJim
The Carlisle system you were referring to was called MARS NP (Mechanaily Attached Roofing System Non-Penetrating). As some of the other posts have described a special base plate was installed under the membrane. A white retainer piece snapped over the membrane onto base plat pinching the membrane, then a cover plate screwed over the retainer. I was a Tec Rep for Carlisle in the 80’s – I thought this was a marvelous bit if engineering, until we learned the retainers were not only pinching the membrane but also poking holes in it. Still it was an improvement on Carlisle’s original MARS – A batten bar set in a bed of Water Cut Off Mastic and fastened through the membrane – no cover strip over the bar. 

I know of one MARS – NP that’s still in service. Has to be 25 years old and ponds about a 1” of water over 40% of the roof. The owner told me about a year ago it leaks once in while, but only when the roof is covered with deep snow and a thaw occurs.


----------



## jjshaggy

ive heard guys talk about mars bars. is that from this system? i figured they weren't talking about candy bars.:laughing:


----------



## RoofPro

*MARS Bar*

That’s right – MARS Bar. Only one I ever saw that worked was on a barrel roof. I guess with enough slope anything will keep the water out. On a low slope roof candy bars may have worked just as well.


----------



## [email protected]

*Carlisle MARS system or other?*

Came across an older EPDM roof system this week that I could not definitively identify. May be a Carlislel MARS system but need verification. The roof is a 45 mil EPDM with 30' wide rolls, glued seams, installed with non-penetrating caps (2") that snap into under-membrane mechanically fastened plates (8"). 4 foot grid pattern.

Any clue as to manufacturer and vintage?

Thanks


----------



## 1985gt

Very close to the style I was talking about. Except instead of the little button things these had a plastic slider then another plastic lock for that. I will post some pictures of it monday when I get to the office. I have one of the attaching clips in the office.


----------



## Grumpy

I haven't seen that exact style of button before. Sorry. It is basically what we were discussing previously, however.


----------



## Palm Beach Roofing

*Used it a few times, but not a big fan.*

Our company, Palm Beach Roofing used this system a couple times, but really weren't impressed. I guess it depends on the type of roof you are working with. Does anyone know a good safety system for us to try to protect workers from falling off the roof? We have to replace the one we have. Thanks.


----------



## 1985gt

Your company has been around since 1994 and you dont know what a good fall protection system would be? I guess ill bite and ask what kind of roofing you do? Depends on type of roofing and building styles, I would guess the a harness and lanyard with a ridge anchor, would be just fine.


----------



## Grumpy

He's just spamming his website.


----------



## 1985gt

Yeah figured as much.


----------



## RooferJim

that dosent lool like the Carlisle one, is there any name on the material, pipe boots etc.. that would be a clue. There were a lot of strange systems back then.


----------



## [email protected]

RooferJim
No batch numbers, date stamps or other markings on the membrane or any other item. I have one contact that believes this is an old Carlisle NP (non-penetrating) system. Different from the MARS bar and mushroom cap. Still haven't found any one that is absolutely sure of the system...still searching.


----------



## 1985gt

SingleSource was the ones who sold the products im refering too. Sorry still didnt get that pic up.

http://www.commercialroofingdirect.com/single-ply.html

while looking around I found this.

http://pacer.ca4.uscourts.gov/opinion.pdf/022104.U.pdf


----------



## 1985gt

Ok finally took some pictures of the non penitrating roof clip things.


----------



## [email protected]

1985gt
That's a very unique fastening system. New to me. Any idea when this system was installed?

 The Argument for Appeal is a typical example of the games that get played in court. No one ever really seems to win in these cases except the lawyers.


----------



## 1985gt

Sigh, I hate when I preview post then move on instead of submit!

I beilve the roofs were installed in the early to mid 90's. These building are the only ones ive seen like it and they have 1000's of squares of it. I had heard that it was all out of towners that did the work and im sure thats not far off base as there is only a few contractors in our area that could manage a job of that size. I would guess of 90% of them need to be replaced as most have pulled from the walls and other leaks caused by the locks. As you can guess leaks can be a PITA with these. They seem to be worse in the winter and again the roofs have little to no slope on them.

I thought it was funny that after looking up single source the 2nd link was that to a law suit. Yes generally the lawyers are the ones who fair far better then any of the partys involved.

I will make sure to hit Submit Reply so I dont have to type this over again!


----------



## siddle

According to me, the best material, but a little expensive would be the rubber roof membrane. However, you have to make sure that you obtain a written agreement with the installer.
______________________

Absolute Steel— Steel building and carport kits with nationwide jobsite delivery. Easy DIY—America’s easiest to install building system. Watch the video & see for yourself.


----------



## siddle

I prefer roofing membranes and synthetic rubber roofing compounds for flat roofs.
________________________

Absolute Steel— Steel building and carport kits with nationwide jobsite delivery. Easy DIY—America’s easiest to install building system. Watch the video & see for yourself.


----------



## jjshaggy

siddle said:


> I prefer roofing membranes and synthetic rubber roofing compounds for flat roofs.
> ________________________
> 
> Absolute Steel— Steel building and carport kits with nationwide jobsite delivery. Easy DIY—America’s easiest to install building system. Watch the video & see for yourself.


 i said this on other replies on this thread i love my single ply too, as an installer, but do agree that coal tar pitch is the best roof. thing is almost nobody does them any more. cost, liability, and lack of knowledgble installers are making it a dinosaur. ive worked with alot of old timers on single ply jobs and theyre awesome til its time to start kicking out rolls, and god help me do any detail work. when i see that it keeps me motivated to not become a one sided roofer, cuz i dont want that to be me. who knows what it'll be like 20 years from now i'll probably have some young punk like myself saying the same sh--.


----------



## london

natural stone slates,hard work but it looks beautiful and solid


----------



## RooferJim

Not on flat roofs though.


----------



## siddle

I support that. Even though natural stone slates looks beautiful and solid its not suited for flat roofs.
____________________
Absolute Steel— Steel building and carport kits with nationwide jobsite delivery. Easy DIY—America’s easiest to install building system. Watch the video & see for yourself.


----------



## topviewroofing

Ed the Roofer said:


> All systems are only as good as the installation and the weather conditions dealt with during the install.
> Ed


:thumbup::yes:


----------



## jeffroofing

I have been using mule hide self adhering roll roofing. I like the face it sticks down just as good as torch down without the flames 

I find it easier to work with then epdm for flat roofs but some applications call for epdm when the roll roofing can not be used.


----------



## topviewroofing

Duro- Last


----------



## 1985gt

topviewroofing said:


> Duro- Last


At least that is what they say. :whistling:


----------



## linderman

RooferJim said:


> single ply roofs. particularly EPDM and PVC. Although I do have a nostalgic fondness for coal tar pitch.
> 
> 
> RooferJim
> www.jbennetteroofing.com


 



coal tar pitch huh ????? you can have all mine


----------



## RoofingDave

Probably EPDM Single ply membrane.

Biggest seller of ours and we like it.

Either that or GRP 

http://www.roofingwarehouse.co.uk


----------



## aaronroofing

definitely EPDM or TPO


----------



## alissayoung

In my personal opinion I think that most of us like green roofing and reason is very obvious that it looks beautiful and create a green natural environment and have a soothing effect on the eyes.


----------



## Grumpy

Allisa, a green roof is any roof that can be considered enviromentally friendly. This could includ a reflective white TPO roof. Is this what you mean, or did you mean a "garden" roof?

If you meant a garden roof, the garden is not actually a roof, but is over burden built atop the water proofing membrane. I personally don't consider the garden on a garden roof to be a roof, I consider the water proofing membrane beneath the roof to be the roof, therefore a garden roof could never be my favorite


----------



## Joe Roofer

I've been doing a lot of Fiber Tite. It's probably better than TPO, they even say it will outlast PVC. It welds easier and I don't have to use any weathered membrane cleaner if it's out in the sun too long. No cut edge sealant ether.


----------



## Pie in the Sky

Joe Roofer said:


> I've been doing a lot of Fiber Tite. It's probably better than TPO, they even say it will outlast PVC. It welds easier and I don't have to use any weathered membrane cleaner if it's out in the sun too long. No cut edge sealant ether.


I like fibertite too... Their specialty is their puncture resistance. If thats Your thing, no one can beat it.


----------



## General Roofing

*Flat Roofing*

We install every flat roofing system there is. Here is a guide to flat roofing systems.

https://www.grscanadainc.com/Flat_Roofing.html



JWilliams said:


> What is your favorite flat roofing system? and why?


----------



## 1985gt

Hypalon, do you install that kind of flat roof system?


----------



## Gladysjames

All Flat Rooting System was Good only.PVC is my Favorite Roofing System.But last time i finished my Roofing Systems in Econstruct they was Good in Services.

http://www.econstructinc.com/Restaurant-Segment.html


----------



## GAZ

JWilliams said:


> What is your favorite flat roofing system? and why?


EPDM flat roof systems is my favorite, its durable and fully recyclable, suitable for both commercial and domestic properties, they are resistant to UV rays and can withstand extreme seasonal change, tried and tested over 50 years, easy to fit and maintain.


----------



## AmericanCustomContractors

GAF

http://www.gaf.com/Roofing/Commercial/Products


----------



## How'd that get there

*Ok I'll play*

So I'm late to the table so maybe I missed it but regardless of covering selection the cover-boards have gone a long way in preventing single ply failures due to collapsed iso. It's hard to beat the redundancy of any BUR......and I do miss the smell of asphalt or heating my sandwich on the tubes...but you can hardly pull into a parking lot with a kettle in tow and not expect the building to be evacuated. Besides the only bur roofers are old roofers. We agreed not to burn down any buildings with torch applied systems and our insurance carrier agreed not to raise our rates...as much... do you all have people in your area that call them rubber roofs? As for the single plys way too many issues with TPO including the solar loading from reflected heat. Have you ever picked up any piece of epdm laying around and noticed it's always wet underneath? However they'd be choice #2. I'd go with the PVC over a coverboard with proper design for R-vaule. Why - 1. ease of application. 2. nice to work on when it's 90 out 3. proven history. 4. welded seams proven to be better than glue or tape


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## MattAngelly

*I Prefer TPO roofing*

Using the 60 mil, the thickest membrane, I have never had any problems installing a TPO roof and have had nothing but happy customers. 

What is TPO roofing? http://www.solomoncontractingstl.com/FAQRetrieve.aspx?ID=49571&Q=

www.solomoncontractingstl.com


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## 1985gt

There is thicker then 60 mil...


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## nancy421

*RE*

I would prefer to use Duro-Last single-ply PVC roofing system as it is more durable and best engineered.


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## TedLeger

One thing to add to Nancy421's reply is that the Duro-Last now comes in 10 foot rolls. That makes it go faster when putting it down.


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## 1985gt

10' rolls still doesn't make it worthy of a dog house.


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## Darkthirty

At-Last used D-L scraps and seconds to build a roof


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## Darkthirty

1985gt said:


> At least that is what they say. :whistling:


Duro-Leak?


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## qualityroofingmel

Built-Up Roof is a good system for flat roofing.


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## Silb

I'm a fan of Built-Up Roof as well. Good system all round


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## mbtechnology

According to the different weather and locality the need of roof and roofing material is different. At the cold places, the hot and warm roofing system is required but the places conducting extremely hot weather is much need with cooler roofing system. 

But rain is the most thing from which every home needs a protection. that is why an waterproof roofing system is more accepted. 
*Layfast SBS* is the best material for waterproofing. http://www.mbtechnology.com provides the best roofing system as per your home requirement.


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