# This can't be right. Elastomeric coating $105 a square?!



## Grumpy

This can't be right... 70 square granulated modified job. The customer wants an elastomeric coating system as proposed by the other roofer. The other roofer's proposal reads as (yes it's just about this basic)

Power wash the existing roof.
Apply Elastomeric coating in 2 coats at 3 gallons per square.
$7,400. 

WTF?! I usualy ball park $250-$300 a square. On this job I figure 2 men a day for wash and repair. His proposal says nothing about any repair or prep work and much of the seams are splitting. Then I figure 3 men 2 days for base and top coat. Total 8 man days or 64 man hours (same thing). 

Material is $6-9k depending on manufacturer and type (acrylic, urethane, sebs). If I were to do this job for less than $15k I'd be stupid. I'd be closer to $17k with the prep using an SEBS. What I think happened is the other guy meant $17,400 and forgot to carry the 1. 

Am I wrong or is this guy a friggin idiot?!


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## Interloc

who knows..it happens in the shingling jobs..:yes:


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## 1985gt

Could be a number of things. Could be using cheap coating. At 3 gals per square seems to be way too much, but could be what ever brand he is using. Bottom line, its way to cheep and he messed up one way or another.


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## Grumpy

3 gallons per square, or 2 applications of 1.5 gallons per square per coat is fairly typical of most elastomeric I have applied. This is so that the material will dry cure to about 24 dry mills. If you're just going for UV, then a silvercoat at like 3 squares per gallon would be fine. See the inverse?


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## 1985gt

I read 2 coats at three gallons per sq.  The product we have used is 1-1.5 gal per sq. per coat. 



> Apply Elastomeric coating in 2 coats at 3 gallons per square.


So at 1.5 per coat per sq is close to the product we use. Either way the other "roofer" is off. 

What brand do you use grumpy?


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## Grumpy

I like Lucas #6000 Universal. I used to use Adurel, I almost started using ER Systems but settled on Lucas for a number of reasons.


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## 1985gt

We us GAF Top Coat. Good stuff, The ER guy has knocked on the door a few times. Never have had a chance to try it out though.


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## Grumpy

The main competitor using GAF top coat around here doesn't even wash their roofs, just broom sweeps them. Hard to compete against that. They are a no frills no thrills 3rd generation commodity roofing company. They suprisingly have a good reputation, because they will own up to their mistaks, but they take so many short cuts... 

I don't know alot about top coat, correct me if I am wrong, they make acrylic only? Acrylic is fine with good slope, but if there is any puddling, it won't hold up for more than a few years.


All my research shows ER is real top of the line product. For logistical reasons I chose not to go with them, but darned near almost pulled the trigger on it.


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## 1985gt

Its Elastomeric, have both water and solvent based. Ponding up to 48 hours like most coating. 

brushing off the roof only? Thats nonsense, I wonder how many times GAF warned them about it. Pretty easy to tell when they are not doing roof prep right.


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## Grumpy

With the volume they move, GAF doesn't care.


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## Grumpy

Grumpy said:


> With the volume they move, GAF doesn't care.


 The statement I just made reminds me of a conversation I was having with the local CertainTeed shingle rep. He was bragging how CertainTeed only allowed quality contractors blah blah blah. I asked then why this one company was still certified because they have pages and pages of complaints with the BBB. He said shocked "Really? They move alof of volume though." to which I replied, "Yeah alot of bad work." Say what you want, but the rules only apply to the small guys. If you have 10 crews out there every day, exceptions are made.


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## 1985gt

True now more then ever. The companys are hurting and they are allowing every tom dick and harry to install their products. We seem to be getting more and more shinglers getting flat roof products, and being certified. There is one company who actually had got a very large job, now they are looking for subs to do it for them. They may be able to handle a flat porch but this is no small little job. Kind of funny I havent seen one of the few of the companys around here that can do that kind of work go for it. Why in the the hell would we want to be a sub on a job for a guy who has no idea how to install a *GOOD* flat roof? I hope they get bit in the azz for it.


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## Grumpy

They'll find someone willing to do it and willing to do it cheaply enough that they'll make a profit. I can get a sub for any size job, problem is 98% are worthless.


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## 1985gt

Not many people around here will be a sub on a flat roof job. maybe something really really big but for the most part if your going to bid it you better be able to handle it. I agree on subs though.


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## Grumpy

If it's a big job, the shinglers will be blinded by dollar signs and willing to give it a shot. It'll be a hack job, but it'll get done.


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## 1985gt

yup thats exactly whats going on with this one some shingle company trying to get in the flat side of things. I hope they make a fool of them selfs and stick to shingles. You dont see us doing any shingles maybe 6 max a year and thats only if its someone we know personally or it will lead to other flat work. Besides most home owners cant afford us, or atleast dont want to.


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## tinner666

We have a flat-roof specialist here. He decided a few months ago to crowd into the slate market. Not sure when he'll be able to walk again, or even how bad the brain damage is. He might go back to flat roofing if he recovers.


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## 1985gt

tinner666 said:


> We have a flat-roof specialist here. He decided a few months ago to crowd into the slate market. Not sure when he'll be able to walk again, or even how bad the brain damage is. He might go back to flat roofing if he recovers.


 
hmm those two do not mix. Sure we/I have layed a couple of slates and spanish tile in my day. My area doesnt see much real slate its all syn, not the hardest stuff to install. We have a good customer who asked us to bid one, real small over a couple of sunrooms being added on. sure no problem. 5 mill house with 12/12 and all cut up, Ill refer them to someone who can do that alot better and faster. As a company we would loose are butts on it. 3/4 of our workers are 30 and under, including me, been around roofing 5 or less years. How many can you guess have ever laid a slate? Besides stacking all of our over stock in to a crate. :laughing: Weve got slates from around the time I was born back when they had workers that could do them.


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## How'd that get there

*Could be*

In these parts there is a monthly auction where the Amish come and buy up all the products sent in by wholesaler's or contractors that have left overs.

I was amazed to see the amount of roofing material there.

Lots of tapered & flat stock iso
Lots of different types of asphalt. aluminum and 55 gallon greenish colored drums of some sort of something.

Stuff went cheap and a couple of the buyers filled their pick ups

I suppose if this guy got the material cheap and has zero overhead he would make out pretty well. 

On top of that you of all people know better than to read too much into the "proposal" heck two coats might mean bushing the brush in one direction and pulling it back!:laughing:


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## Single-ply Guy

He obviously made a mistake. We would be in the ballpark of 13k but its what we do. We are fast and have all the equipment, training, etc....


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## JWRoofing

Maybe the guy is buying Kool-seal or something cheap like that. Using Gako Western Silicone, I would be well over $15K on a roof that size (With cleaning, permit and assuming moderate repairs).



JW
__________________
Miami Roof Restoration
Miami Home Inspections


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